They make an absolute abomination of themselves by the lies they tell and how they prey upon people for massive self-gain. Sadly, many of them have an enormous following. These false teachers are to be called out and people made aware of who and what they really are.

One such (of many) is Joel Osteen. In a sermon given in 2017 John MacArthur uses Osteen's own words to show what is the truth of who and what he is. Never the less, Osteen packs out a massive arena every week. People love to have their ears tickled, sadly.


“Let me be blunt. Joel Osteen is a pagan religionist. He is a legalist, he is a quasi-pantheist, and Jesus Christ is a footnote to satisfy the critics and to give him access to Christians. He believes that men save themselves by their inherent power. He has a definitive book called Your Best Life Now. He says that anyone can create all the dreams that he desires by faith and words. You want health, you want wealth, you want happiness, success; you want a new car, a new house, a new job, a new wife, whatever, whatever; you literally can speak it into existence.

Let me give you quotes from his book Your Best Life Now. And, oh, by the way, this is only your best life if you’re going to hell. If you’re going to heaven this is not your best life. So for those people who follow him, this may be their best life.

Let me quote: “If you develop an image of success, health, abundance, joy, peace, and happiness, nothing on earth will be able to hold those things from you.” That’s the law of attraction.

Another quote: “All of us are born for earthly greatness. You were born to win. You were born to be a champion. God wants you to live in abundance. He wants to give you the desires of your heart. Before we were formed He prepared us to live abundant lives, to be happy, healthy, and whole. But when our thinking becomes contaminated it is no longer in line with God’s Word.”

Here’s another quote: “You’re thinking positive, and He will bring your desires to pass. He regards you as a strong, courageous, successful person. You are on your way to a new level of glory. God’s Word is not Scripture, God’s Word is the message you are hearing from God, and then you speak forth and you attract the reality that you speak.” Joel Osteen says, “Believe, visualize, speak out loud and your words release your power, giving life to what you want.”

Here's some more quotes: “Friend, there’s a miracle in your mouth.” Here’s another one. Listen to this prayer, Joel Osteen’s prayer: “I thank You, Father, that I have Your favor.” Ooh, that sounds like Luke 18: “I thank You, Father, that I’m not like this poor publican.”
Here’s another: “I know these principles are true, because they have worked for me and my wife.” Well, that’s a good basis to determine whether something’s true. They work for you because you’re getting rich at the expense of people who are divesting themselves of what they have on false pretenses. You’re at the top of the Ponzi scheme.

He says, “We even speak into existence a perfect parking spot at the mall.” Here’s the theology behind the thinking, quote: “God has already done everything He’s going to do; the ball is in your court.” Really? “So God’s not sovereign. I’m sovereign; the ball’s in my court.” This is hyper-Pelagianism.

At this point we recognize the real source of Joel Osteen’s religion and all the rest of these people. He is a mouthpiece for Satan. So are all the rest of them. So when I watched the inauguration and I see Paula White in the middle, just terrifying. And then I hear the new President say that she’s his favorite preacher to whom he’s been listening since 2007? Frightening.

Why are all these false teachers so successful? Because they’re in line with Satan who’s the god of this world, prince of the power of the air, who rules in the sons of disobedience. This is going to be successful because the fallen world will embrace it. This is false Christianity from hell – no biblical understanding of God, no biblical understanding of man, no biblical understanding of sin, no recognition of total depravity, man’s universal inability to do anything in the flesh that pleases God, let alone think himself to be God who can speak into existence something that he desires.

Let me tell you something: God does not give the unregenerate man what he naturally longs for. God doesn’t fulfill the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life. And when you say that it is God giving you what you in your natural fallen longings want, you are calling God Satan. That’s what you’re doing.

I’ll say it again: God does not give the unregenerate person what in his natural longings he desires. That’s the love of the world – the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, the pride of life. God is not in the business of fulfilling evil, selfish, self-indulgent desires. What the gospel does promise is salvation for the broken and the shattered and the heartsick and the guilty and the fearful and the threatened who have come to grips with their sin and the judgment of God, and desperately want deliverance. We have to know the true God.

Just such a grief to me. I remember the psalmist said, “The reproaches that fall on you fall on me.” What does that really mean? Well, Jesus when He went into the temple and He tore into everybody and threw them out, that must have been – there are a lot of scenes in the Gospels I would want to have seen. That’d probably be the favorite.”

—Excerpt from a John MacArthur sermon from Jan. 23, 2017
"Rejecting Heresy About God the Father"

There is absolutely no way I could agree more Rockmart. Remember when he turned away hurricane victims in Houston because the church had just gotten new carpet ? Unbelievable.

Not a problem if you ignore them all

(03-01-2024, 12:16 PM)Replying to Tomato Sandwich Not a problem if you ignore them all

I get your point. But in reality, they are still "a problem", per se. Look at that stadium full of deceived people, firstly. But more importantly, they are deceiving people and doing it in the name of Christ. That's a massive problem.

But, yeah, to your point... if I or anyone else ignores them, they're not a problem to me, individually.

Now, if we could just get all of those poor souls packing out that whatever-arena each Sunday to also ignore them.

(03-01-2024, 12:19 PM)Replying to RockmartDawg

(03-01-2024, 12:16 PM)Replying to Tomato Sandwich Not a problem if you ignore them all

I get your point. But in reality, they are still "a problem", per se. Look at that stadium full of deceived people, firstly. But more importantly, they are deceiving people and doing it in the name of Christ. That's a massive problem.

But, yeah, to your point... if I or anyone else ignores them, they're not a problem to me, individually.

Now, if we could just get all of those poor souls packing out that whatever-arena each Sunday to also ignore them.

I give so little what others do, I can not agree with you. And when I say all of them, I mean ALL of them. I have no time need for any of it.

(03-01-2024, 12:28 PM)Replying to Tomato Sandwich

(03-01-2024, 12:19 PM)Replying to RockmartDawg

(03-01-2024, 12:16 PM)Replying to Tomato Sandwich Not a problem if you ignore them all

I get your point. But in reality, they are still "a problem", per se. Look at that stadium full of deceived people, firstly. But more importantly, they are deceiving people and doing it in the name of Christ. That's a massive problem.

But, yeah, to your point... if I or anyone else ignores them, they're not a problem to me, individually.

Now, if we could just get all of those poor souls packing out that whatever-arena each Sunday to also ignore them.

I give so little what others do, I can not agree with you. And when I say all of them, I mean ALL of them. I have no time need for any of it.

For the sake of the folk in the stands every week, I can somewhat agree with you (not fully, though). They are there because of their own inner desires. That is fully on them. But they are being deceived (that's where others need to step in).

For the sake of the truth of Christ and the truth, false teachers do need to be pointed out. The apostle Paul, the apostle John, the apostle Peter, James, and Jude all warned of false teachers in their letters to the churches where they ministered, all which are now part of the Bible. Paul explicitly told Timothy to do the same. The writer of Hebrews wrote of the importance of their readers paying "closer attention to what we have heard, so that we do not drift away from it." That's pretty much the entirety of the New Testament.

But more importantly, Jesus Himself warned of false teachers. The reason why Jesus was so much at odds with the Pharisees was because they were supposed to be the teachers of Israel, supposed to teach the people, and Israel was supposed to be a light to the nations (the Gentiles outside of Israel). But they were false teachers themselves. They ended up having Jesus killed because of His opposition.

3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

2 Timothy 4:3-4 KJV

You easily and truthful could change the opening of verse 3 to "For the time is here...)

Sadly The Osteen, Copeland, Meyers type preachers are giving the masses just what they want to hear and not what they need to hear.

(03-01-2024, 11:34 AM)Replying to RockmartDawg They make an absolute abomination of themselves by the lies they tell and how they prey upon people for massive self-gain. Sadly, many of them have an enormous following. These false teachers are to be called out and people made aware of who and what they really are.

One such (of many) is Joel Osteen. In a sermon given in 2017 John MacArthur uses Osteen's own words to show what is the truth of who and what he is. Never the less, Osteen packs out a massive arena every week. People love to have their ears tickled, sadly.


“Let me be blunt. Joel Osteen is a pagan religionist. He is a legalist, he is a quasi-pantheist, and Jesus Christ is a footnote to satisfy the critics and to give him access to Christians. He believes that men save themselves by their inherent power. He has a definitive book called Your Best Life Now. He says that anyone can create all the dreams that he desires by faith and words. You want health, you want wealth, you want happiness, success; you want a new car, a new house, a new job, a new wife, whatever, whatever; you literally can speak it into existence.

Let me give you quotes from his book Your Best Life Now. And, oh, by the way, this is only your best life if you’re going to hell. If you’re going to heaven this is not your best life. So for those people who follow him, this may be their best life.

Let me quote: “If you develop an image of success, health, abundance, joy, peace, and happiness, nothing on earth will be able to hold those things from you.” That’s the law of attraction.

Another quote: “All of us are born for earthly greatness. You were born to win. You were born to be a champion. God wants you to live in abundance. He wants to give you the desires of your heart. Before we were formed He prepared us to live abundant lives, to be happy, healthy, and whole. But when our thinking becomes contaminated it is no longer in line with God’s Word.”

Here’s another quote: “You’re thinking positive, and He will bring your desires to pass. He regards you as a strong, courageous, successful person. You are on your way to a new level of glory. God’s Word is not Scripture, God’s Word is the message you are hearing from God, and then you speak forth and you attract the reality that you speak.” Joel Osteen says, “Believe, visualize, speak out loud and your words release your power, giving life to what you want.”

Here's some more quotes: “Friend, there’s a miracle in your mouth.” Here’s another one. Listen to this prayer, Joel Osteen’s prayer: “I thank You, Father, that I have Your favor.” Ooh, that sounds like Luke 18: “I thank You, Father, that I’m not like this poor publican.”
Here’s another: “I know these principles are true, because they have worked for me and my wife.” Well, that’s a good basis to determine whether something’s true. They work for you because you’re getting rich at the expense of people who are divesting themselves of what they have on false pretenses. You’re at the top of the Ponzi scheme.

He says, “We even speak into existence a perfect parking spot at the mall.” Here’s the theology behind the thinking, quote: “God has already done everything He’s going to do; the ball is in your court.” Really? “So God’s not sovereign. I’m sovereign; the ball’s in my court.” This is hyper-Pelagianism.

At this point we recognize the real source of Joel Osteen’s religion and all the rest of these people. He is a mouthpiece for Satan. So are all the rest of them. So when I watched the inauguration and I see Paula White in the middle, just terrifying. And then I hear the new President say that she’s his favorite preacher to whom he’s been listening since 2007? Frightening.

Why are all these false teachers so successful? Because they’re in line with Satan who’s the god of this world, prince of the power of the air, who rules in the sons of disobedience. This is going to be successful because the fallen world will embrace it. This is false Christianity from hell – no biblical understanding of God, no biblical understanding of man, no biblical understanding of sin, no recognition of total depravity, man’s universal inability to do anything in the flesh that pleases God, let alone think himself to be God who can speak into existence something that he desires.

Let me tell you something: God does not give the unregenerate man what he naturally longs for. God doesn’t fulfill the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life. And when you say that it is God giving you what you in your natural fallen longings want, you are calling God Satan. That’s what you’re doing.

I’ll say it again: God does not give the unregenerate person what in his natural longings he desires. That’s the love of the world – the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, the pride of life. God is not in the business of fulfilling evil, selfish, self-indulgent desires. What the gospel does promise is salvation for the broken and the shattered and the heartsick and the guilty and the fearful and the threatened who have come to grips with their sin and the judgment of God, and desperately want deliverance. We have to know the true God.

Just such a grief to me. I remember the psalmist said, “The reproaches that fall on you fall on me.” What does that really mean? Well, Jesus when He went into the temple and He tore into everybody and threw them out, that must have been – there are a lot of scenes in the Gospels I would want to have seen. That’d probably be the favorite.”

—Excerpt from a John MacArthur sermon from Jan. 23, 2017
"Rejecting Heresy About God the Father"

Not being a JO defender, but it seems like his message is one of positivity (I think that is what draws people) what is so bad about being positive? Other than fleecing people which I think he is doing.

One of the signs of the end times is the church will be full of false teachers.

(03-01-2024, 01:09 PM)Replying to redpantsdawg One of the signs of the end times is the church will be full of false teachers.

Yup.

(03-01-2024, 01:07 PM)Replying to Milldawg

(03-01-2024, 11:34 AM)Replying to RockmartDawg They make an absolute abomination of themselves by the lies they tell and how they prey upon people for massive self-gain. Sadly, many of them have an enormous following. These false teachers are to be called out and people made aware of who and what they really are.

One such (of many) is Joel Osteen. In a sermon given in 2017 John MacArthur uses Osteen's own words to show what is the truth of who and what he is. Never the less, Osteen packs out a massive arena every week. People love to have their ears tickled, sadly.


“Let me be blunt. Joel Osteen is a pagan religionist. He is a legalist, he is a quasi-pantheist, and Jesus Christ is a footnote to satisfy the critics and to give him access to Christians. He believes that men save themselves by their inherent power. He has a definitive book called Your Best Life Now. He says that anyone can create all the dreams that he desires by faith and words. You want health, you want wealth, you want happiness, success; you want a new car, a new house, a new job, a new wife, whatever, whatever; you literally can speak it into existence.

Let me give you quotes from his book Your Best Life Now. And, oh, by the way, this is only your best life if you’re going to hell. If you’re going to heaven this is not your best life. So for those people who follow him, this may be their best life.

Let me quote: “If you develop an image of success, health, abundance, joy, peace, and happiness, nothing on earth will be able to hold those things from you.” That’s the law of attraction.

Another quote: “All of us are born for earthly greatness. You were born to win. You were born to be a champion. God wants you to live in abundance. He wants to give you the desires of your heart. Before we were formed He prepared us to live abundant lives, to be happy, healthy, and whole. But when our thinking becomes contaminated it is no longer in line with God’s Word.”

Here’s another quote: “You’re thinking positive, and He will bring your desires to pass. He regards you as a strong, courageous, successful person. You are on your way to a new level of glory. God’s Word is not Scripture, God’s Word is the message you are hearing from God, and then you speak forth and you attract the reality that you speak.” Joel Osteen says, “Believe, visualize, speak out loud and your words release your power, giving life to what you want.”

Here's some more quotes: “Friend, there’s a miracle in your mouth.” Here’s another one. Listen to this prayer, Joel Osteen’s prayer: “I thank You, Father, that I have Your favor.” Ooh, that sounds like Luke 18: “I thank You, Father, that I’m not like this poor publican.”
Here’s another: “I know these principles are true, because they have worked for me and my wife.” Well, that’s a good basis to determine whether something’s true. They work for you because you’re getting rich at the expense of people who are divesting themselves of what they have on false pretenses. You’re at the top of the Ponzi scheme.

He says, “We even speak into existence a perfect parking spot at the mall.” Here’s the theology behind the thinking, quote: “God has already done everything He’s going to do; the ball is in your court.” Really? “So God’s not sovereign. I’m sovereign; the ball’s in my court.” This is hyper-Pelagianism.

At this point we recognize the real source of Joel Osteen’s religion and all the rest of these people. He is a mouthpiece for Satan. So are all the rest of them. So when I watched the inauguration and I see Paula White in the middle, just terrifying. And then I hear the new President say that she’s his favorite preacher to whom he’s been listening since 2007? Frightening.

Why are all these false teachers so successful? Because they’re in line with Satan who’s the god of this world, prince of the power of the air, who rules in the sons of disobedience. This is going to be successful because the fallen world will embrace it. This is false Christianity from hell – no biblical understanding of God, no biblical understanding of man, no biblical understanding of sin, no recognition of total depravity, man’s universal inability to do anything in the flesh that pleases God, let alone think himself to be God who can speak into existence something that he desires.

Let me tell you something: God does not give the unregenerate man what he naturally longs for. God doesn’t fulfill the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life. And when you say that it is God giving you what you in your natural fallen longings want, you are calling God Satan. That’s what you’re doing.

I’ll say it again: God does not give the unregenerate person what in his natural longings he desires. That’s the love of the world – the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, the pride of life. God is not in the business of fulfilling evil, selfish, self-indulgent desires. What the gospel does promise is salvation for the broken and the shattered and the heartsick and the guilty and the fearful and the threatened who have come to grips with their sin and the judgment of God, and desperately want deliverance. We have to know the true God.

Just such a grief to me. I remember the psalmist said, “The reproaches that fall on you fall on me.” What does that really mean? Well, Jesus when He went into the temple and He tore into everybody and threw them out, that must have been – there are a lot of scenes in the Gospels I would want to have seen. That’d probably be the favorite.”

—Excerpt from a John MacArthur sermon from Jan. 23, 2017
"Rejecting Heresy About God the Father"

Not being a JO defender, but it seems like his message is one of positivity (I think that is what draws people) what is so bad about being positive? Other than fleecing people which I think he is doing.

His message is certainly of positivity. But, he says he is a church and a preacher of God's word. The examples MacArthur used are perfect exhibits of why his teaching is so wrong, and so dangerous.

But... what you said triggered an old dusty corner in my memory. This involves something a really good preacher, Paul Washer, said about Joel Osteen several years ago. This is covered in this video, below. What I think is emphasized in this is "discernment". There is a time to be encouraging and there are people for whom certain encouraging words are proper, but some people they're not proper. By that, what I mean is that some things that are intended for born again believers are not proper context for someone who is not a born again believer. You can't blanket apply some things to the masses.

BUT! What is said here is applicable. This is actually really good.

---

(03-01-2024, 01:09 PM)Replying to redpantsdawg One of the signs of the end times is the church will be full of false teachers.

Definite sign of the present times.

---

(03-01-2024, 12:53 PM)Replying to Rogasingingdawg 3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

2 Timothy 4:3-4 KJV

You easily and truthful could change the opening of verse 3 to "For the time is here...)

Sadly The Osteen, Copeland, Meyers type preachers are giving the masses just what they want to hear and not what they need to hear.

Very well said, Roga. They're leading tremendous numbers of people to their own destruction, and make them feel good the entire way there.

(03-01-2024, 01:24 PM)Replying to RockmartDawg

(03-01-2024, 01:07 PM)Replying to Milldawg

(03-01-2024, 11:34 AM)Replying to RockmartDawg They make an absolute abomination of themselves by the lies they tell and how they prey upon people for massive self-gain. Sadly, many of them have an enormous following. These false teachers are to be called out and people made aware of who and what they really are.

One such (of many) is Joel Osteen. In a sermon given in 2017 John MacArthur uses Osteen's own words to show what is the truth of who and what he is. Never the less, Osteen packs out a massive arena every week. People love to have their ears tickled, sadly.


“Let me be blunt. Joel Osteen is a pagan religionist. He is a legalist, he is a quasi-pantheist, and Jesus Christ is a footnote to satisfy the critics and to give him access to Christians. He believes that men save themselves by their inherent power. He has a definitive book called Your Best Life Now. He says that anyone can create all the dreams that he desires by faith and words. You want health, you want wealth, you want happiness, success; you want a new car, a new house, a new job, a new wife, whatever, whatever; you literally can speak it into existence.

Let me give you quotes from his book Your Best Life Now. And, oh, by the way, this is only your best life if you’re going to hell. If you’re going to heaven this is not your best life. So for those people who follow him, this may be their best life.

Let me quote: “If you develop an image of success, health, abundance, joy, peace, and happiness, nothing on earth will be able to hold those things from you.” That’s the law of attraction.

Another quote: “All of us are born for earthly greatness. You were born to win. You were born to be a champion. God wants you to live in abundance. He wants to give you the desires of your heart. Before we were formed He prepared us to live abundant lives, to be happy, healthy, and whole. But when our thinking becomes contaminated it is no longer in line with God’s Word.”

Here’s another quote: “You’re thinking positive, and He will bring your desires to pass. He regards you as a strong, courageous, successful person. You are on your way to a new level of glory. God’s Word is not Scripture, God’s Word is the message you are hearing from God, and then you speak forth and you attract the reality that you speak.” Joel Osteen says, “Believe, visualize, speak out loud and your words release your power, giving life to what you want.”

Here's some more quotes: “Friend, there’s a miracle in your mouth.” Here’s another one. Listen to this prayer, Joel Osteen’s prayer: “I thank You, Father, that I have Your favor.” Ooh, that sounds like Luke 18: “I thank You, Father, that I’m not like this poor publican.”
Here’s another: “I know these principles are true, because they have worked for me and my wife.” Well, that’s a good basis to determine whether something’s true. They work for you because you’re getting rich at the expense of people who are divesting themselves of what they have on false pretenses. You’re at the top of the Ponzi scheme.

He says, “We even speak into existence a perfect parking spot at the mall.” Here’s the theology behind the thinking, quote: “God has already done everything He’s going to do; the ball is in your court.” Really? “So God’s not sovereign. I’m sovereign; the ball’s in my court.” This is hyper-Pelagianism.

At this point we recognize the real source of Joel Osteen’s religion and all the rest of these people. He is a mouthpiece for Satan. So are all the rest of them. So when I watched the inauguration and I see Paula White in the middle, just terrifying. And then I hear the new President say that she’s his favorite preacher to whom he’s been listening since 2007? Frightening.

Why are all these false teachers so successful? Because they’re in line with Satan who’s the god of this world, prince of the power of the air, who rules in the sons of disobedience. This is going to be successful because the fallen world will embrace it. This is false Christianity from hell – no biblical understanding of God, no biblical understanding of man, no biblical understanding of sin, no recognition of total depravity, man’s universal inability to do anything in the flesh that pleases God, let alone think himself to be God who can speak into existence something that he desires.

Let me tell you something: God does not give the unregenerate man what he naturally longs for. God doesn’t fulfill the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life. And when you say that it is God giving you what you in your natural fallen longings want, you are calling God Satan. That’s what you’re doing.

I’ll say it again: God does not give the unregenerate person what in his natural longings he desires. That’s the love of the world – the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, the pride of life. God is not in the business of fulfilling evil, selfish, self-indulgent desires. What the gospel does promise is salvation for the broken and the shattered and the heartsick and the guilty and the fearful and the threatened who have come to grips with their sin and the judgment of God, and desperately want deliverance. We have to know the true God.

Just such a grief to me. I remember the psalmist said, “The reproaches that fall on you fall on me.” What does that really mean? Well, Jesus when He went into the temple and He tore into everybody and threw them out, that must have been – there are a lot of scenes in the Gospels I would want to have seen. That’d probably be the favorite.”

—Excerpt from a John MacArthur sermon from Jan. 23, 2017
"Rejecting Heresy About God the Father"

Not being a JO defender, but it seems like his message is one of positivity (I think that is what draws people) what is so bad about being positive? Other than fleecing people which I think he is doing.

His message is certainly of positivity. But, he says he is a church and a preacher of God's word. The examples MacArthur used are perfect exhibits of why his teaching is so wrong, and so dangerous.

But... what you said triggered an old dusty corner in my memory. This involves something a really good preacher, Paul Washer, said about Joel Osteen several years ago. This is covered in this video, below. What I think is emphasized in this is "discernment". There is a time to be encouraging and there are people for whom certain encouraging words are proper, but some people they're not proper. By that, what I mean is that some things that are intended for born again believers are not proper context for someone who is not a born again believer. You can't blanket apply some things to the masses.

BUT! What is said here is applicable. This is actually really good.

---

(03-01-2024, 01:09 PM)Replying to redpantsdawg One of the signs of the end times is the church will be full of false teachers.

Definite sign of the present times.

---

(03-01-2024, 12:53 PM)Replying to Rogasingingdawg 3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

2 Timothy 4:3-4 KJV

You easily and truthful could change the opening of verse 3 to "For the time is here...)

Sadly The Osteen, Copeland, Meyers type preachers are giving the masses just what they want to hear and not what they need to hear.

Very well said, Roga. They're leading tremendous numbers of people to their own destruction, and make them feel good the entire way there.

Thanks for the response and clarity, that was a good video.

(03-01-2024, 01:40 PM)Replying to Milldawg

(03-01-2024, 01:24 PM)Replying to RockmartDawg

(03-01-2024, 01:07 PM)Replying to Milldawg

(03-01-2024, 11:34 AM)Replying to RockmartDawg They make an absolute abomination of themselves by the lies they tell and how they prey upon people for massive self-gain. Sadly, many of them have an enormous following. These false teachers are to be called out and people made aware of who and what they really are.

One such (of many) is Joel Osteen. In a sermon given in 2017 John MacArthur uses Osteen's own words to show what is the truth of who and what he is. Never the less, Osteen packs out a massive arena every week. People love to have their ears tickled, sadly.


“Let me be blunt. Joel Osteen is a pagan religionist. He is a legalist, he is a quasi-pantheist, and Jesus Christ is a footnote to satisfy the critics and to give him access to Christians. He believes that men save themselves by their inherent power. He has a definitive book called Your Best Life Now. He says that anyone can create all the dreams that he desires by faith and words. You want health, you want wealth, you want happiness, success; you want a new car, a new house, a new job, a new wife, whatever, whatever; you literally can speak it into existence.

Let me give you quotes from his book Your Best Life Now. And, oh, by the way, this is only your best life if you’re going to hell. If you’re going to heaven this is not your best life. So for those people who follow him, this may be their best life.

Let me quote: “If you develop an image of success, health, abundance, joy, peace, and happiness, nothing on earth will be able to hold those things from you.” That’s the law of attraction.

Another quote: “All of us are born for earthly greatness. You were born to win. You were born to be a champion. God wants you to live in abundance. He wants to give you the desires of your heart. Before we were formed He prepared us to live abundant lives, to be happy, healthy, and whole. But when our thinking becomes contaminated it is no longer in line with God’s Word.”

Here’s another quote: “You’re thinking positive, and He will bring your desires to pass. He regards you as a strong, courageous, successful person. You are on your way to a new level of glory. God’s Word is not Scripture, God’s Word is the message you are hearing from God, and then you speak forth and you attract the reality that you speak.” Joel Osteen says, “Believe, visualize, speak out loud and your words release your power, giving life to what you want.”

Here's some more quotes: “Friend, there’s a miracle in your mouth.” Here’s another one. Listen to this prayer, Joel Osteen’s prayer: “I thank You, Father, that I have Your favor.” Ooh, that sounds like Luke 18: “I thank You, Father, that I’m not like this poor publican.”
Here’s another: “I know these principles are true, because they have worked for me and my wife.” Well, that’s a good basis to determine whether something’s true. They work for you because you’re getting rich at the expense of people who are divesting themselves of what they have on false pretenses. You’re at the top of the Ponzi scheme.

He says, “We even speak into existence a perfect parking spot at the mall.” Here’s the theology behind the thinking, quote: “God has already done everything He’s going to do; the ball is in your court.” Really? “So God’s not sovereign. I’m sovereign; the ball’s in my court.” This is hyper-Pelagianism.

At this point we recognize the real source of Joel Osteen’s religion and all the rest of these people. He is a mouthpiece for Satan. So are all the rest of them. So when I watched the inauguration and I see Paula White in the middle, just terrifying. And then I hear the new President say that she’s his favorite preacher to whom he’s been listening since 2007? Frightening.

Why are all these false teachers so successful? Because they’re in line with Satan who’s the god of this world, prince of the power of the air, who rules in the sons of disobedience. This is going to be successful because the fallen world will embrace it. This is false Christianity from hell – no biblical understanding of God, no biblical understanding of man, no biblical understanding of sin, no recognition of total depravity, man’s universal inability to do anything in the flesh that pleases God, let alone think himself to be God who can speak into existence something that he desires.

Let me tell you something: God does not give the unregenerate man what he naturally longs for. God doesn’t fulfill the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life. And when you say that it is God giving you what you in your natural fallen longings want, you are calling God Satan. That’s what you’re doing.

I’ll say it again: God does not give the unregenerate person what in his natural longings he desires. That’s the love of the world – the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, the pride of life. God is not in the business of fulfilling evil, selfish, self-indulgent desires. What the gospel does promise is salvation for the broken and the shattered and the heartsick and the guilty and the fearful and the threatened who have come to grips with their sin and the judgment of God, and desperately want deliverance. We have to know the true God.

Just such a grief to me. I remember the psalmist said, “The reproaches that fall on you fall on me.” What does that really mean? Well, Jesus when He went into the temple and He tore into everybody and threw them out, that must have been – there are a lot of scenes in the Gospels I would want to have seen. That’d probably be the favorite.”

—Excerpt from a John MacArthur sermon from Jan. 23, 2017
"Rejecting Heresy About God the Father"

Not being a JO defender, but it seems like his message is one of positivity (I think that is what draws people) what is so bad about being positive? Other than fleecing people which I think he is doing.

His message is certainly of positivity. But, he says he is a church and a preacher of God's word. The examples MacArthur used are perfect exhibits of why his teaching is so wrong, and so dangerous.

But... what you said triggered an old dusty corner in my memory. This involves something a really good preacher, Paul Washer, said about Joel Osteen several years ago. This is covered in this video, below. What I think is emphasized in this is "discernment". There is a time to be encouraging and there are people for whom certain encouraging words are proper, but some people they're not proper. By that, what I mean is that some things that are intended for born again believers are not proper context for someone who is not a born again believer. You can't blanket apply some things to the masses.

BUT! What is said here is applicable. This is actually really good.

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(03-01-2024, 01:09 PM)Replying to redpantsdawg One of the signs of the end times is the church will be full of false teachers.

Definite sign of the present times.

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(03-01-2024, 12:53 PM)Replying to Rogasingingdawg 3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

2 Timothy 4:3-4 KJV

You easily and truthful could change the opening of verse 3 to "For the time is here...)

Sadly The Osteen, Copeland, Meyers type preachers are giving the masses just what they want to hear and not what they need to hear.

Very well said, Roga. They're leading tremendous numbers of people to their own destruction, and make them feel good the entire way there.

Thanks for the response and clarity, that was a good video.

I agree. I thought it was very well done and they were treading some dicey territory in what they discussed. My hat is off to those guys. I'm glad folk like that are around to teach morans like me. 

Yawn.